E206: Carrianne Dukes and Dan Zahajkiewicz

Carrianne Dukes [00:00:04]:
Hello, and welcome to another episode of eCom@One. Today's guest is Dan and myself, and we are actually in front of a live audience. So, unfortunately, for you guys, you've got us today because Richard decided to go on his jollies and go all the way to Thailand.

Dan [00:00:22]:
Yeah. So we start with this. So thank you, Richard.

Carrianne Dukes [00:00:27]:
Well, no. This is gonna be a really good conversation about everything about podcasting. We're going to give insight on, obviously, behind the scenes, so the tech side, also the mindset that you need for the podcast as well. I'll also touch on the guests and how we manage to secure 25 k worth of sponsorship just purely from a year a couple of years of podcasting. But I think first things first, I think for Dan, for anybody out there, what advice would you give, to somebody who's thinking of starting a podcast?

Dan Z [00:00:59]:
You know, there's so many different advices, that you could give. But I think, first of all, don't overthink it because it's so easy to think about the equipment and visuals and and and so many technical bits that, so many people coming to me and asking me about the equipment and what we actually, end up happening, the conversations steer towards steer towards just hitting that record button. You know? So I think that's the biggest hurdle for people is to actually hit the record button and and, you know, dive into it. I would say as soon as as long as you have, you know, passionate subject that you wanna talk about, as long as you have idea which niche you're targeting, I think just go with it. You know, hit the record button because a lot of things, a lot of answers will come along the way. So I would look at it as a process. You know? So many people wanna start when they feel ready and everything is perfect. And believe me, your first episode and your episode, even 10 episode or episode number 20, they're gonna be completely different.

Dan [00:02:13]:
You know? Give yourself some slack and just start.

Carrianne Dukes [00:02:16]:
It's scary though, isn't it?

Dan [00:02:18]:
Maybe. Yeah. Because there's so many new elements involved. But I think, yeah, just starting, you know? Start badly. That that would be my best advice, seriously. Because you might put, on yourself, like, unhealthy set of expectations, especially that you're putting something out there. You're gonna be judged. You're gonna judge yourself.

Dan [00:02:39]:
You're probably not used to hearing yourself back. So and and watching yourself on a video if you, if you're opting in for a, you know, video podcast. So there's a lot of things that, you know, you're gonna have to, adapt to and learn. You know? So I think just a a student kind of attitude. You know? Okay. I'm starting from level zero, and that's okay. And let me grow. You know? A lot of people trying to to start when they already, you know, on the top of the hill if you like.

Dan [00:03:09]:
You know? And I I like that saying actually. When it comes to any kind of process, it's like a lot of us want to be on the top of the mountain forgetting that, you know, the most beautiful journey is actually when you climb up. You know? So allow yourself to climb up on this journey. You know? Start from level zero and slowly slowly start start on improving things. So, yeah, my my my piece of advice would be start badly.

Carrianne Dukes [00:03:31]:
Yeah. That's so true. And I think it's important to remember that people don't actually care as much about you as you actually do yourselves. And actually, people want to celebrate you and see the amazing, like, sort of work that you've done. And you've got something valuable to say as well, don't you? And people don't realize that. So yeah. No. I think that's great advice.

Carrianne Dukes [00:03:48]:
Amazing. So I think from my side of things, obviously, I'm more a marketer sort of side of things than a mindset. So I think when somebody's starting out a podcast, I think it is really important to remember your why. What actually is your objective in doing the podcast? Because for us, we started it obviously four years ago. So the Ecom at One podcast is Yeah. Obviously, we've got 200 episodes. And at the start, it was very much it was gonna be a lead generation tactic.

Dan [00:04:12]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:04:12]:
That was what we were going to do. And we wanted to get new prospects through that funnel, and then become clients with us. But that changed a lot over the four years.

Dan [00:04:20]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:04:20]:
And it became more of that thought leadership piece and the brand piece and also the relationship building pieces, what the podcast is for. So I think it's always remember your why, and that comes across in all marketing. There's got to be an objective

Dan [00:04:33]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:04:34]:
Because you can get lost. And, also, it requires a lot of commitment. Mhmm. So if you don't have a why and if it doesn't have a purpose, you will just stop. Yeah. Because like you know, it takes hours to record the podcast, prepare the podcast, edit the podcast. So it's like a good standard. Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:04:49]:
So it's got to, yeah, it's got to have an objective.

Dan [00:04:52]:
Yeah. Exactly. I couldn't agree more. And that why will be your foundation in those moments where you're gonna think, like, oh, let's just give up, you know, because, it might be overwhelming at the beginning. That's why I said start badly because the hurdles are to be expected, you know. So, also helps when you're really passionate about something, you know, and you're naturally sharing that stuff, with other people, you know. So if you're passionate about this that the topic, that kind of, overtakes everything, and, and then it just feels like like your second nature, but it takes time. It's a process for sure.

Carrianne Dukes [00:05:30]:
Yeah. It is it is a process, and it's one might say you've got to have that mindset of being a learner and that growth mindset of you're gonna make a lot of mistakes. Things aren't going to be perfect. Far too many. No. Never. And we still do now, don't we? So it's it's always gonna be a learn learning curve and things change.

Dan [00:05:46]:
Recording or creating video in general, it's becoming easier than ever. But, it still, you know, includes some technicalities and and equipment. So, obviously, like with anything, it's a learning curve. So, yeah, give yourself some time.

Carrianne Dukes [00:06:03]:
Yeah. And I think you've got to remember as well how much can you commit to. Because podcasting, obviously, it's a commitment, and your audience that you're trying to build are going to expect something from you. So if you're saying you're gonna release a podcast weekly, you've got to release a podcast weekly. I don't think there's no right or wrong in regards to what you should commit to. I think it's just being that transparent, honest with your audience. Like, okay. You're gonna expect a podcast every Monday morning at 6AM.

Carrianne Dukes [00:06:29]:
It's going to be live, or I'm gonna do seasons because I can commit to that. It's just that consistency piece. And like you say, I think it's Stephen Bartlett that actually always goes on about those 1% improvements every week.

Dan [00:06:40]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:06:41]:
So if you just focus on that and just keep improving and keep sort of testing things as well That's a great point. Yeah. Seeing what works and what isn't working Yeah. To just, like, grow it.

Dan [00:06:50]:
Absolutely. Many people get stuck on a on a equipment side of things, you know, that I get so many questions. And that that's usually conversation started when it comes to podcast I've done, what equipment I should be using. And, you know, then I like to poke that person a a little and, you know, scratch through the surface and actually see whether you're using the question about or your concerns about the equipment actually as an excuse not to start recording, you know. Because I see people who are really passionate about the things, and they don't care. They use phones. They use different things. And I personally, being in, you know, video production world, I see productions where, you know, the the invest initial investments, it's, you know, thousands and thousands of pounds.

Dan [00:07:36]:
And I see viral videos produced on the phones that, you know, you can feel the passion, so people don't really care about the what equipment was used. Obviously, when it comes to equipment, you, you wanna keep certain standards because these days, everybody's using great stuff to record and the competition is high. So, obviously, you you do wanna keep a certain standard, but I would definitely wouldn't use it as a as a main point of focus. You know? Because many people feel like they're gonna buy cameras worth thousand of pounds and then boom. That's my podcast. That's my that's my video. It's gonna be amazing. Everybody's gonna watch it.

Dan [00:08:18]:
It's really it's, you really need to look behind the scenes first before you start asking things about equipment. You know? So, topics that you're choosing Yes. Or what kind of genre, what niche. You know? These are way more important things than actually, you know, which microphones I should use. Get your first few episodes done, you know. Find your voice a little bit. Find what you wanna talk about. Define that message.

Dan [00:08:46]:
And then, okay, you can come to me and then we can speak about the the the equipment because it's so customizable as well. And it's, you know, it depends on so many factors, like, you know, what space do you have to record? Like, what budget do you have? At what stage on a journey you are on at the moment? So, you know, I usually stay away from from recommending any equipment right away when somebody asking me. You know? Mhmm. I much rather build some foundation there and and go from there.

Carrianne Dukes [00:09:16]:
Yeah. You say that to me all the time. Whenever I'm like, what equipment whenever people ask me Yeah. You're like, it's that's not as important as people make out. Like I say, I think it's content first having something valuable to say Exactly. And that passion that comes through. Because obviously, when we started four years ago, we then went into lockdown, and we started with literally Richard had books on his, like, kitchen table, a laptop, and then some, like, microphone I think he bought, like, ten years ago.

Dan [00:09:41]:
There you go.

Carrianne Dukes [00:09:42]:
Yeah. And we literally use, like, Zoom. Yeah. That's what we use for the podcast book. Our first guest was somebody that's really big in the SEO industry, Greg Gifford. And Andy, our, like, him our director was literally fangirling because he was buzzing that we had Greg Gifford on. But Greg Gifford didn't care that that was the equipment that we were using. Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:10:00]:
His content resonated, and it came across really, like, really well. But like I say, now we've got this level of equipment, but not everyone needs this. Yeah. We invested in this because it's a huge part of our marketing, and we use it. And it's we use the video stuff for other elements of marketing content creation as well. Yeah. But we didn't start with this. We probably didn't have this until you really started this sort of level.

Carrianne Dukes [00:10:23]:
So that was, like, over a year ago. So we did three years Right. Like Zoom

Dan [00:10:28]:
Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:10:29]:
And then sort of decent microphones, but not all this, like, extra Mhmm. Sort of quality stuff. And it grew, and we got the sponsorship, and we got the sort of, brand awareness from it.

Dan [00:10:39]:
Yeah. So, obviously, you you you're proving the point. You you guys were committed to it already. So, you know, scaling up on, on equipment was a no no brainer. But how did you measure that?

Carrianne Dukes [00:10:52]:
Yeah. I think for us, we measure obviously, we're marketers, so there's always got to be some form of return on investment with our marketing efforts. And like I said at the start, it came lead generation. But if we always measured this podcast on lead generation, in all brutal honesty, it wouldn't be worth it. It's not it's that's not what we do it for, especially now. But that brand awareness piece, that thought leadership piece, it's worth every penny because we use it not only to elevate our guests, but also elevate our team and that sort of personal development. Right. We've had guests on there which have been prospects for us because we've wanted them to, become become clients.

Carrianne Dukes [00:11:30]:
Yeah. But we've also got our partners on there because that's a huge part of our marketing

Dan [00:11:34]:
Mhmm.

Carrianne Dukes [00:11:35]:
Is our partnership, ecosystem. So we get our partners on here, build those relationships with them, get them out there. Yeah. And then also they invest, by sponsoring our events. And then our events bring in the leads, and then obviously that helps us get business.

Dan [00:11:49]:
There you go.

Carrianne Dukes [00:11:50]:
So it's that whole sort of long term vision thinking that you need to have with podcasting. Yeah. But again, it you need to determine success depending on your why and

Dan [00:11:58]:
your objective.

Carrianne Dukes [00:11:59]:
Exactly. So that's what it sort of comes down to. But, yeah, podcasting has been amazing for us, in so many sort of elements, and it's really set us apart. Mhmm. Agencies, especially ecommerce agents agencies, there's so many out there. It's really competitive. But people are, oh, Richard. Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:12:16]:
You're the guy that's on that podcast. Yeah. Oh, you've had that guest on. And, also, secretly, I probably shouldn't say this, but we actually get guests

Dan [00:12:24]:
Too late.

Carrianne Dukes [00:12:25]:
This is why I'm not allowed out. Richie keeps me inside. We actually get guests on to learn from them to then improve our what we do on the agency. So like our frameworks, it's like we get, like, link building guests on top of our link building. Yeah. We get ecommerce guests on there to help our clients. So we learn so much from it, and that's, in my opinion, invaluable

Dan [00:12:46]:
Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:12:46]:
Because then that helps us grow the agency.

Dan [00:12:49]:
But also, like, just purely from content creation point of view, like, your natural curiosity around the topics. Mhmm. Basically, you know, your audience can feel it when you're furious when you're asking questions because there's a big chance that the audience has a similar question. So I think that's kind of, like, a perfect alignment. Like, you know, you you want to know. Like, you're not asking questions just for a sake of asking questions. It's actually there that, you know, that practical element there that you you need that knowledge yourself. So I think that's perfect.

Carrianne Dukes [00:13:19]:
Yeah. No. It it has been amazing for us. So yeah. But yeah. It has been a journey, and it's a journey we'll keep going on. And now, obviously, we've got our other podcast, which is the agency intensive. Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:13:29]:
But that's for a different audience, and that's what you've always got to think about. It's always what it's it's about your audience. So who are you trying to build? What is it that they actually care about? What's the value that you can bring to them? Because it's it's very competitive. People are so busy. So if they're giving you an hour of their time, bloody hell, you should appreciate that.

Dan [00:13:46]:
Oh, for sure.

Carrianne Dukes [00:13:47]:
Because you're literally in there, like, earphone. In marketing, how often do you get that sort of intimate conversation with somebody? Very rarely. Yeah. Social media is, like, six second, ten second videos. A podcast is forty, fifty an hour. That's a real opportunity to build that relationship.

Dan [00:14:02]:
For sure. Especially that, you know, marketing itself. It's, you know, there's always that question, how can I speak to my customers? And I think podcast is one of these ways where you can actually naturally build that relationship, you know, because they're just listening to your conversation, so they feel like they know you. So then it's much easier to to basically get them interested when it comes to your services, when it comes to your actual advice on, you know, behind this agency. So, yeah, it's a just a perfect way to to merge those two words, I'll I'll I'll believe.

Carrianne Dukes [00:14:37]:
Yeah. And our clients, like, love the podcast as well, so that client retention side of it.

Carrianne Dukes [00:14:42]:
Now you might be looking for an SEO boost, a down to earth digital PR campaign to share your story, or maybe just some straightforward technical help to amp up your performance. Now that's where Ecom Now comes in, a partner that's all about making things easier for your online store. Our services cover everything from creating professional content for your ecommerce categories to refining your product descriptions. Now whether you're just starting out or been in it for a while, we're here to deliver real impactful results that add to your bottom line without unnecessary commitments. You can order one off or multiple projects with a quick turnaround. Simply choose what you need.

Carrianne Dukes [00:15:22]:
I think from obviously what you said, earlier about obviously this scary side of podcasting and just sort of get out there. That's scary.

Dan [00:15:30]:
Sorry. It's not scary side.

Carrianne Dukes [00:15:33]:
And I think it is scary, like, being behind a camera. Right. We've had some good giggles, haven't we? About me behind I think it takes me about 10 takes to do one sentence.

Dan [00:15:41]:
That'd be

Carrianne Dukes [00:15:41]:
good. Yeah. It's fun. I mean,

Dan [00:15:42]:
it's like just to get a picture.

Carrianne Dukes [00:15:45]:
But so it's scary. So what advice would you give to somebody with their confidence behind a camera?

Dan [00:15:52]:
You know, I definitely feel more comfortable behind the camera rather than being in the front of camera. Yeah. But to be honest with you, it's just practice, you know. I I film with hundreds of clients and, it is a skill that comes with practice, basically. You know? I've seen many great, speakers that they have no problem of communicating, but when they sat down in front of camera, they struggle. So I think it's a different kind of relationship because you're talking to the camera often, you know. So, there's no feedback. So it feels like you're talking to yourself, and you're becoming, you know, more and more self conscious.

Dan [00:16:28]:
And then you pay attention to little things that you you you normally wouldn't during the conversation. You know? So I think staying present. A podcast makes it easier, I believe, than creating a video on your own, just talking to the camera because there is that feedback loop. You know? There is a conversation. There's a, a subject in front of me that I can focus on and, you know, I'm, basically, you know, have that feedback so it's way easier. I often told people when they struggle to when they struggle to create, videos on their own, I said to them, put a picture of a person that you know, your friend, that you trust and feel comfortable with. Put it on the top of your lens, on the top of your phone, and and talk to them like you talk to the camera like you would talk to them because I

Carrianne Dukes [00:17:14]:
thought he was gonna say for a light dance at the moment,

Dan [00:17:15]:
didn't he? No. Different ritual. I often give that analogy. You know when your first time you you go to work, like, your first time you're a first timer and you don't know anybody, you you haven't been in a workforce before, so you kind of you don't know what to do with yourself, you know? Yeah. You don't know how to behave and you're very self conscious. But after a few days or weeks, like, you know, you you kind of settle down. It's alright, you know?

Carrianne Dukes [00:17:41]:
Bringing the fish in the office, you know, become, like, the most hated person in the office. Yeah.

Dan [00:17:45]:
It's kinda where your personality comes out. And I think it's the same thing. Like, you know, give some time. Give some time. Give some practice, and, and and you'll naturally find your voice. So practice is the the by far the best way of getting comfortable in the front of camera. I also feel like how prepared are you? Yeah. You know? Because, like, knowing your topics, so that competent piece.

Dan [00:18:07]:
If you feel competent, like, or you did your job in regards to presentation or, you know, subject research or whatever, that also gives you some foundation that you you can lean on. Because, like, if you if you feel prepared, you know your subject, it's great. It's worse when, you know, you you're nervous, and you don't know what you're talking about. That's a perfect storm. In a way, basically, you know, you're gonna be thinking, what am I talking about? You know, you're gonna start becoming self conscious. You're gonna stumble on your words, etcetera, etcetera. So it definitely helps when you know your your topic. Like like, for example, podcast is something that is our bread and butter.

Dan [00:18:45]:
Yeah. We haven't spent too much time preparing for this poster, did we? It was few few minutes conversation, but just, you know but if it was different subject matter, what we needed to, you know, do some research, we would. And, you know so, yeah, I would say practice as they are. It's it's it's my advice when it comes to confidence. Finding your own voice come will come with time.

Carrianne Dukes [00:19:05]:
Yeah. I think well, I see a lot of people out there that are quite, like, ballsy. Like, they're quite loud and vibrant behind a camera. Do you think people need to be like that? You know, like shouty and

Dan [00:19:15]:
No. Not everyone is Gary Vee. You know? There's a time and place for different flavor. But if you naturally feel like you're more of a calmer person, I think you should be going with that. Obviously, camera eats away a lot of energy. So if you feel like you're being a little bit too much, you're probably not. Mhmm. So I always tell people to kind of dial it up a little bit, you know, so, they feel like exaggerating.

Dan [00:19:38]:
But actually, when you watch it back on the camera, it's fine. We actually see some expression.

Carrianne Dukes [00:19:42]:
Ultimately, if you're putting on a character, there's only so long surely that you could be that character for before it falls apart or you lose your probably own identity. And I think there's a lot of YouTubers that I see that put on like a character and they do lose themselves. Yeah. And when you're building that relationship, people wanna build a relationship with somebody that's authentic, and that's who they are. Yeah.

Dan [00:20:04]:
So I

Carrianne Dukes [00:20:04]:
think, like you say, I think that makes sense.

Dan [00:20:06]:
I think there's a time and place for everything. If if someone is in a character all the time because that's their stick Yeah. Fair enough. Like, you know? But, from from a person who's starting, it's it's not a nice feeling watching yourself back for the first time or, you know, you we're not used to hearing ourselves back. So when you feel that I when I heard myself for the first time, I was like, who's that voice? You know? And people some people were complimenting it, And I was like, nah. You know? So it takes a little bit of time to get used to that. So that's all.

Carrianne Dukes [00:20:39]:
So I think, like you say, at the start, it's very important to be, like, content first with the podcast. But topics is a huge conversation piece that I have with people. Yeah. So how do you recommend that people decide on what topic that they should base their podcast about?

Dan [00:20:56]:
Right. Definitely something that you're passionate about.

Carrianne Dukes [00:20:59]:
Yeah.

Dan [00:21:00]:
You know? But I being in a creative space for quite some time, I know it's quite difficult to come with the fresh ideas all the time. So, all I can share is something from from my experience what's helping me because I bet everyone would have a different different kind of advice for for this question. So, first of all, I think it's the mindset that you're approaching your content creation. You know? So I had a great advice from, I was watching a a a q and a of a speaker. I think it was Seth Godin. I think he was one of the fathers of email marketing. Yeah. And, he's he's all he does at the moment, I think, is writing daily blogs.

Dan [00:21:40]:
And somebody asked him, like, how do you come up with the ideas every single day? That must be a struggle. And he said something simple, but yet profound, at least for me. He said, I wake up in the morning with a thought in my mind that by the end of the day, I will have a story to tell. And that was such a mind opening, statement for me because literally when you wake up and you and you decide you're gonna have a story by the end of the day, you will. Trust me.

Carrianne Dukes [00:22:09]:
Yeah.

Dan [00:22:09]:
Your brain will filter out the information that's coming you coming to you through throughout the day. And you'll you're gonna start seeing different things, and they just gonna, you know, connect together in a way. You know? So, so that was a a great piece of advice for me. Obviously, looking out for trendy topics.

Carrianne Dukes [00:22:33]:
Yeah.

Dan [00:22:34]:
You know? So I always feel like if you if you're creating content on a consistent basis, I would always suggest to have a good mix of, trendy topics and evergreen topics.

Carrianne Dukes [00:22:48]:
Mhmm. So

Dan [00:22:49]:
there's a good mixture. There's stuff that you can talk. We could talk about it today. Yeah. That's gonna be relevant in a year from now. You know, that's evergreen side. And trendy topics, it's actually something that's, you know, people talking about it right now.

Carrianne Dukes [00:23:03]:
Yeah. Jumping on that. So yeah.

Dan [00:23:05]:
Exactly. Jumping on that wagon of that piece of information will, you know, if you're creating something interesting that that definitely is going to be exposed by social platforms because they also like to feed the, you know, something

Carrianne Dukes [00:23:19]:
algorithm. Yeah.

Dan [00:23:20]:
The the algorithm with trendy topics because that's what people, wanna wanna talk about. So, yeah, think of yourself as a content creator, kind of thing. Like, you know, so then then you you your brain will naturally start filtering out the information throughout the day that will allow you to build, build, and build, and build. You know?

Carrianne Dukes [00:23:38]:
Yeah. I think, speak to your audience as well. Like, what content do they want to see? I I've done a bit of client research recently speaking to, obviously, our ecommerce retailers and be like, okay. We've got this podcast. What topics do you want us to cover that you'd be interested in? And it was actually very interesting, the sort of stuff that they said, that they wanted to hear because they wanted more, like, mindset, more top level of being a human being and running a business and growing a retailer store opposed to the intricacies of, like, how to do, I don't know, blog writing or SEO. They wanted more more that to be inspired to feel something. Sure. So that was a really sort of viable piece of information.

Carrianne Dukes [00:24:23]:
Because one thing that we did over the four years that we was our biggest mistake was not niching down enough. Right. Because, obviously, our audience is ecommerce. That's what our podcast is about. But that's so broad. There's so many, like, different elements in ecommerce that we could focus on. So we basically got the podcast audited and decided, okay, who is it that we want to target? Who's our audience? And it was those $6.07, 8 figure businesses, the business owners, the ecommerce directors. They have very different issues, and challenges and pain points, depending on the size of their business.

Carrianne Dukes [00:24:59]:
So that then helped to shape our podcast guests that we got on, but also the theme of the podcast questions because you can't talk to everybody.

Dan [00:25:08]:
You Sure.

Carrianne Dukes [00:25:09]:
It's it's you won't be talking to anybody if you're trying to talk to everybody. Yeah. So you really do need to sort of niche down Yeah. And think of your audience and think what adds value to them. Yeah. And as well, that's the reason why we got sponsorship. We got £25,000 just purely from sponsorship for a year of podcast because that that tech partner wanted to get in front of the audience that we had built.

Dan [00:25:32]:
Sure.

Carrianne Dukes [00:25:33]:
So that's why they invested. If we had if we didn't have an audience built or we didn't say who our audience were, they would be like, well, I'm not gonna give you £25,000 because I'm not gonna see a return on it. Sure. I wanna get in front of these people, and that's why I'm going to invest. So, yeah, I think it comes down to your audience, isn't it? And, like I say, having a content

Dan [00:25:54]:
sort of approach. Yeah. Yeah. And I bet some of the topic guys, the ideas come to you when you're actually meeting different people.

Carrianne Dukes [00:26:01]:
Yeah. So

Dan [00:26:01]:
maybe you could share something about guest booking. How do you actually, you know, go through the process of researching people? Is it spontaneous? Is it more, like, you know, some advanced research behind it? Are you are you are you contacting MI six?

Carrianne Dukes [00:26:15]:
Yeah. Pretty much. I've done some really

Dan [00:26:17]:
spy on them first.

Carrianne Dukes [00:26:19]:
I've done some really interesting ways to try and get guests. It's hilarious. So, obviously, when you don't have a podcast, it's then, like, very hard to get podcast guests on.

Dan [00:26:27]:
So at

Carrianne Dukes [00:26:28]:
the start, I was like, please anybody. No. I'm joking. I wasn't. So it's okay. You need to go in with, like, the value proposition. So you need to be like, this is what the podcast is. This is who it's aimed at.

Carrianne Dukes [00:26:38]:
This is what I want you to sort of talk about. But the one of the funniest way that I've tried to get a guest is we tried to get the sort of senior digital guy at Lush, because obviously they're huge. They've got stores. They've got an online sort of retail, space. And I basically went through their customer support, because I know well, they're gonna reply to customer support because they're gonna reply. And they passed me through to him and gave me his email in the end. So I was literally like, hi. I've got this podcast.

Carrianne Dukes [00:27:05]:
And then, yeah, it took a bit of a process, and it just turned out he was too busy, but I am gonna re chase him. But there is there's loads out there. You'll be surprised how many people are actually willing to be a guest. Yeah. Like, say, if you somebody's passionate about something, they want to share that message, don't they? And you're giving them a platform to share a message that they're passionate about. Yeah. So ask them. I do a lot of LinkedIn DMs.

Carrianne Dukes [00:27:26]:
A lot comes from relationships as well that I've got. And also when we get a guest on, I always ask for them to refer someone because in the business world, people tend to hang out with people similar to them. Right. So if, I've had guests from, like, Greg Gifford. He was really big on SEO. He recommended, and passed me on the details of the head of brand at Semrush, which is a huge SEO tool because he had that connection. And people typically in this world are really helpful and really nice. There's also softwares, so websites out there, which you can source guests from.

Carrianne Dukes [00:28:00]:
So there's like Matchmaker, and you literally just type in the sort of topic and industry, and it comes up with loads of people that want to go on podcasts. So it's it's there is obviously more automated ways you can do it. You can send out, like, automated messages on LinkedIn, but I prefer that more personalized approach myself

Dan [00:28:19]:
Sure.

Carrianne Dukes [00:28:20]:
Because the guest that we want on, I think it's really important for us to make sure that the guests are a good quality as well Yeah. For to protect our audience. Because if there's somebody that we get on that is just crap chatting crap, and they're like like and they're saying stuff which is false, Like, that's gonna resonate to us because we're getting our guest on and giving them platform.

Dan [00:28:41]:
Fine business. Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:28:43]:
So we've got to protect our audience, but also ourselves, and also the guest in a sense. Yeah. So that's a few ways that I've sort of got guests on. Obviously, others are just relationships that, like, Richard's Bill as well. Sure.

Dan [00:28:57]:
So networking mainly.

Carrianne Dukes [00:28:58]:
Yeah. Networking. Honestly, I I get loads of expos because there's one thing, people are fine and happy to ignore you on email. If you ask them to their face, Jesus Christ, they don't run away. It's my yes success rate to their face is far higher. So So yeah. Go where they

Dan [00:29:14]:
are. Conversation.

Carrianne Dukes [00:29:15]:
Right. Go where they are and jump on them

Dan [00:29:16]:
Right. Effectively. It sounds like you're not taking no for the answer.

Carrianne Dukes [00:29:20]:
It's years and years of no's.

Dan [00:29:22]:
Right. Right. You've just got

Carrianne Dukes [00:29:23]:
to have that mental I've had so many no's.

Dan [00:29:25]:
Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:29:26]:
It's just you just gotta keep going.

Dan [00:29:28]:
Because I bet that the part of them always want would like to come and Yeah. And kind of promote their services and and their brand, whatever, like, you know. But because it's a video podcast Yes. And you're putting yourself out there, that can create hesitation. Like, you know. But I see the most companies today, the big especially big companies or whatever, they they they have a media department. Yeah. Like, you need to you need to be a media media company as well as whatever else that you're doing because if you want your narrative there, you just need to be visible, you know.

Dan [00:30:01]:
And, video is one of the mediums that is being, you know, consumed by millions. So it's simply you you can't ignore it anymore, like, you know. So I guess you need to get yourself out of your comfort zone. Even if you're uncomfortable, start doing something or or basically have a person in your company who's gonna be responsible for that. You know?

Carrianne Dukes [00:30:23]:
Exactly. Nothing good ever happens in your comfort zone, does it? So you've just got to just try. All you can do is try. Try your best. If they say no, what's they just don't come on. Like, it's not the end of the world, is it? It's not personal. People are busy. People have different priorities.

Carrianne Dukes [00:30:37]:
Sure. People have different preferences. Yeah. And it's just ask them, okay. You don't wanna come on. Do you know anyone that would want to come on? But also, it's important to, I think, like I mentioned, vet your podcast guests, because it's it resonates and it's to you as well.

Dan [00:30:50]:
So Yeah. Of course.

Carrianne Dukes [00:30:51]:
But also have get podcast guests on there that you have a genuine interested in as well. Because like you said earlier, the conversation would be much richer if you're genuinely interested in that topic. And good podcasting it comes down to good conversation.

Dan [00:31:04]:
I bet it was way more difficult to get, booked guests before before you prove the con con concept. Yeah. Now you have we have 200 episodes plus, so it's easy. It's like, oh, this is what we produce. Yeah. Have a look. You know, it's established. There's more credibility there.

Dan [00:31:22]:
So I guess, you know, it's it's way easier for guests to commit. You know? But what would you say to what would be your advice to someone who's literally starting and trying to book a guest?

Carrianne Dukes [00:31:32]:
I think use your network that you've already built. Obviously, ask them to sort of recommend, but just ask like like I said with Greg Gifford, we had no prior sort of conversation to with him. Right.

Dan [00:31:43]:
And

Carrianne Dukes [00:31:43]:
he was a big game in this sort of industry. And he we were like, we've we're doing this podcast. We're really passionate about it. And I think, like I say, it's passion. It's pa because we were passionate about it. It was like, this is it's gonna help educate people. It's gonna inform them. And he was like, yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:31:59]:
I'd love to. And then Yeah. Like, him got on it, and then we used our relationships that we built for years in this sort of game. But also just just do episodes yourselves. Obviously, you don't have to have a podcast where it's like ours, which is in, like, interview format. Sure. You you've got something valuable to say. And if you're passionate about a subject, you know something.

Carrianne Dukes [00:32:19]:
So just jump on the mic yourself and put it out there. Yeah. Improve the concept that way. Obviously, now it's much easier because we've got bigger names on there that we can leverage. I go, oh, we've had people from Google. We've had people from BigCommerce. We've had people from, like, Seesaw. And Yeah.

Carrianne Dukes [00:32:33]:
So so it's easier to leverage that to people we don't know.

Dan [00:32:36]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:32:36]:
But, also, if you have a passion for something, and you show the benefit of just, like, educating people, sharing their message as well, that they'll if they don't if they say no, they say no, and then you move on and you try somebody else. There's a lot of people out there that are really, really smart, and they're really passionate. So just, yeah, just keep trying, I think.

Dan [00:32:58]:
I also think if you're inviting a person who's, maybe have a a lot more experience than yourself, like, showing that passion for learning, you know? Yeah. Man, I I wanna have a conversation with you because I wanna learn something from you, you know? Yeah. I think, people like that, you know, and they're usually willing to to share whatever they can share in order to help your journey. So

Carrianne Dukes [00:33:20]:
Yeah. Be honest, isn't it? It's like, yeah, this I haven't got any episodes left.

Dan [00:33:24]:
I've done yet

Carrianne Dukes [00:33:25]:
or anything like that.

Dan [00:33:25]:
I'm I'm new to it. Don't try

Carrianne Dukes [00:33:27]:
to Hello.

Dan [00:33:28]:
Don't try to spin away, like, listen. We have some big names. At the beginning, just be honest. Mhmm. Tell them where you are and why you wanna create the podcast. And I feel like you're gonna have some success booking booking amazing guests.

Carrianne Dukes [00:33:42]:
Yeah. You are.

Dan [00:33:43]:
So we hope you enjoyed this conversation. That was helpful. Also, we thank our audience for participating. And, yeah, if you would like to find out more about the podcasting, please give us a shout.

Carrianne Dukes [00:33:55]:
No. Thank you, Dan. And, yeah, thank you to our amazing audience, but it's been a pleasure. And, yeah, that's

Dan [00:34:00]:
No book recommendation.

Carrianne Dukes [00:34:01]:
Oh, god. We always ask for a book recommendation. We need to keep the recall, I guess. Okay. What's your book recommendation, Dan, while I think about it?

Dan [00:34:10]:
I thought about it before, and I thought, man. So many great books. But I think within the context that would help you as a as a content creator, the one book that helped me a lot was, Deep Work.

Carrianne Dukes [00:34:24]:
Okay. Yes.

Dan [00:34:24]:
You know? Mhmm. It's basic concept of it is like multitasking doesn't work. Yeah. If you truly wanna dive into a task, you you don't you don't wanna do five things at once. You know? So create a time block where you can actually sit down, and deal with this, thing in the front of you and then jump to the next one. Especially as a content creator, you're looking for inspiration, you know, elsewhere. And let's say let's say I have this project, this idea in mind that the that you wanna work on, and then I'm jumping on the research. I'm checking YouTube.

Dan [00:35:02]:
I'm checking different different platforms. You know? I catch myself, like, I'm doing the research, but at some point, I'm just watching YouTube. I was like, what am I doing? You know? So I think you need a good as a content creator, you need a good balance between content creation and content consumption. You know, it can be tricky because you wanna know what's up there and what kind of videos are trending now and stuff like that. But also, you kind of need to limit that time for of distractions and and create something yourself.

Carrianne Dukes [00:35:36]:
Yeah. Yeah.

Dan [00:35:36]:
What about yourself? What kind of book are you gonna recommend?

Carrianne Dukes [00:35:39]:
So mine isn't marketing related. It's something I've just read recently, which I thought was really good. So it's, Glucose Revolution. Right. So it's about glucose spikes. So that's why I didn't eat before this because it's very interesting.

Dan [00:35:51]:
Right.

Carrianne Dukes [00:35:51]:
So it's about balancing your sugar levels. Yeah. So obviously, to do with attention, health, and stuff like that. So if you eat sugar or, like, heavy carbs before some of it spikes and then you crash. Whereas if you sort of balance it, obviously, much healthier. But also you've got more energy. So, yeah, I didn't eat before this because I know I'll I'll have a sandwich and then I'll crash and then I'll be reading what everyone and everyone will fall asleep. So, yeah, I think that's a really interesting book if you're interested in managing your sugar.

Dan [00:36:16]:
We're gonna link both in the show notes.

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:19]:
Yes.

Dan [00:36:19]:
Right?

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:20]:
Mhmm.

Dan [00:36:20]:
So you're gonna become gluten free, and you have plenty of of time for your for your tasks. Sugar.

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:26]:
Just eat it with protein. Right.

Dan [00:36:27]:
Thank you, Carrie.

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:28]:
No worries. No. Thank you, Dan. It's been a pleasure.

Dan [00:36:30]:
Yeah. Likewise. Thank you. See you again.

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:31]:
See you later. Goodbye.

Carrianne Dukes [00:36:37]:
If If you enjoyed this episode, hit the subscribe or follow button wherever you are listening to this podcast so you're always the first to know when a new episode is released. Have a fantastic day, and I'll see you on the next one.